This extensive interview with philosopher C. Thi Nguyen explores the profound impact of metrics and gamification on human values, agency, and meaning. Drawing from his book 'The Score,' Nguyen distinguishes between the playful, exploratory nature of games and the soul-deadening effect of real-world metrics that flatten values and attention. He critically examines how modern society's obsession with quantification, efficiency, and perceived objectivity leads to 'value capture,' eroding trust, hindering nuanced perception, and obscuring the inherent value judgments embedded in technology and data.